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Date: 4/10/2000 1:45:00 PM
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Author:
connie
(cmaem@hotmail.com)
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Subject:Joe
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One of the best early childhood educators I have ever had the pleasure of working with was a man. His name was Joe. I have just trasferred centres and I was sad to leave him. It seemed that the children respected him more that they did the women. In a world of single mother homes he is the male role model.
Some of the stories that he has told me were when a mother followed him home and showed up on his doorstep with a bottle of wine and other romanic items!!!! His girlfriend at the time (now his wife) answered the door. boy was that mother embarassed. Other mothers have made coments to him that if a male said these things to a woman they would be charged with sexual harassment.
When he was in collage (I went to school as well with him but we wern't good friends) I am not sure if it was him or another one of the 3 male students, but a job placement wouldn't let him take the children in to the washroom alone. Just because he was a male.
Right now there is a male student at the day care and he was placed with Joe. This student is not up the standard and will fail this placement.
Alot of people think that just because he works at a day care he is gay, but he had a lot of fun in collage (shall we say) and now is happily married with a couple of kids. I hope to work with him again.
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Date: 3/11/2002 4:14:00 PM
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Author:
CD.sups>ecc@Adlink.com.au
(Deb)
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Subject:fathers
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Hello I work at Head Start and we have been working on a group geared to fathers or significant males in the lives of our children. WE have meetings just for the males and single fathers so they can be a group of men discussing any concerns they may have with their children or even personal problems. They are not singaled out because they are invited to all our parent meetings. We just have a seperate group for males who wish to join. They do arts and crafts, have group discussions and if there are specific problems workshops are set up with professional speakers to further help. We try to make our centers male frindly by hanging pictures, speaking to dads as well as moms and inviting them to voluteer whether it be on field trips, helping in the class or anything that may interest them. We have quite q few single fathers and the numbers seem to go up every year. If anyone has any other ideas to get males more involved please e-mail me. Hope this helps and thanks.
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Date: 8/7/2002 6:13:00 PM
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Author:
mac
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Subject:This is a very interesting topic. I just...
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This is a very interesting topic. I just want to say that I think that males are greatly needed in the ECE field.
I have a male friend in the field that does a wonderful job and the children respond very well to him.
As educators we try to teach children to treat each other as equals, and try to eliminate "male" roles or "female" roles. If we try to keep males out of the ECE field what kind of message will this send to the children?
It takes a special person to teach and meet the needs of children. Men can do this just as well as women.
Good luck with your study.
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Date: 8/16/2002 10:56:00 AM
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Author:
Steve
(stevemcm@hotmail.com)
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Subject:Males in ECE
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This has been an uplifting board! I have been working in the ECE field for about the past 15 years I have a Masters degree in ECE. I started out in the preschool room but have worked in infant rooms and 3 to 5 year old rooms as well. Has there been discrimination...well I think that is a very strong word to just throw around.....there were times when I was asked to change tires for people, primarly women, and was pulled out of the room to do this. I was tasked to shovel sidwalks and do the "manly" details around the center.
Currently I am the Director of a large center, I have 80 staff, out of those I have 3 male staff members. Two of the staff work directly with the children and one is our cook.
I hire the most capable people reguardless of sex, age or skin color and if that happens to be a male...GREAT. It is my belief that children need to feel loved and charished and that can be done by males as well as females. Most of my parents feel very comfortable with the males caring for their children, I have had very few complaints at all. Of course you get the occasional parent who is not comfortable with the male, usually a new parent with an infant girl.
It is hard to be a male in this field and I tell all my male staff to safeguard themselves against aligations of abuse....for example, while changing girls diapers make sure that someone knows what you are doing. I also tell them that it is okay to love on the children but do it in appropriate ways so that there can never be a question of your intentions.
In my career I have seen some horrible care givers and some awesome care givers, they have been both male and female.
In reference to Judy....."Shame on you!" You are exactly the type of person who puts organizations in danger of lawsuits for sexual harrasment and discrimination not to mention union complaints. You would have a very difficult time mantaining a postition that requires you to be sensitive about diversity. I do not understand how you can possible deal with children effectivly with the kind of attitude towards diversity you displayed on this post.
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Date: 8/23/2002 8:09:00 PM
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Author:
jay
(munch_alot103@hotmail.com)
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Subject:Hi Craig I am a first year Teachers col...
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Hi Craig
I am a first year Teachers college student in New Zealand. I am doing Early childhood and in my year group of around 70 there are no males. this is very dissipointing as i believe males are great in centres and children do look up to them
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Date: 4/20/2006 11:54:00 AM
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Author:
Melody-Little Sonbeams Christian Daycare & Preschool
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Subject:Males in ECE...
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OH MY GOSH! All I can say is, "BOY ARE SOME WOMEN IGNORANT!!!"
My husband and I own and operate our own Group Home Childcare/Preschool business. We've been doing it for about 4 years and it has been the best career move of our life!
Some of these women saying, "Why would any man want to work with children?" or "What's their motivation?" or "It's just a female's role" and "Children need a mommy, granny, or aunt"...these women need to get a grip! Children need men and women in their lives!!! Shall we just ban all dads from their childrens lives??? You women are really presenting yourself in a very uneducated way and are looking very unprofessional and naive.
I say BRAVO BRAVO BRAVO to all of you men in the childcare/education field!!!
Both boys and girls in my home cildcare come running up to my husband for hugs, to sit on his lap, etc. In a society where parent's work so much, children need care from BOTH genders. They need female AND MALE role models!!!
I ADMIRE AND APPLAUDE ALL OF YOU MALE CAREGIVERS AND EDUCATORS!!!
There will always be uneducated/ignorant women who think that there are ulterior motives to men working with small children. But there are also some pretty creepy females out there too women!
MEN, STAND TALL! YOU ARE DOING AN AWESOME JOB!!!
KUDOS TO YOU ALL!
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Date: 4/10/2000 6:52:00 PM
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Author:
Craig d'Arcy
(cd.sups.ecc@adlink.com.au)
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Subject:males
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Thankyou Connie for responding to my message. I wonder what country are you from?
It was interesting to hear that Joe wasn't allowed in the bathroom by himself with other children. I suppose that all workers should follow the practice of always being with another staff member. In Australia, in general, workers are VERY aware of this issue and all centres take steps to ensure no worker is left alone.
I am aware of one Long Day care centre near me that had 2 males working there, so they suddenly decided that they needed to have new policies in place e.g. they couldn't work on the same shift together. I asked the director if 2 females working together would need the same policy - she said no. I told her that if I was one of these guys I wouldn't work at that centre. Have you come across any such policies in your experience?
I wonder if you read this and could tell me if you were aware of Joe being the 'handyman' around the place, doing things that were not in his job description. I have found this to be a problem.
If anybody else is reading this and has some stories to share, I would be very grateful. Thankyou.
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Date: 4/13/2000 4:31:00 PM
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Author:
Doris
(dglowicki@aol.com)
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Subject:Males
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I have worked with several men, both good and bad, just like the women with which I have worked. I have never worked with a man or woman who sexually abused a child, nor have I worked with a man who physically abused a child. Notice I did not include "woman" in the above sentence. However, whenever I talk about having worked with men, I usually get the "Were they okay with the kids? How could you stand to work for a center that hired men?" I have a co-worker who notified a parent that a private van service which transports her daughter to kindergarten that the driver was a man and the little girl was the only passenger. The parent requested another driver, which resulted inthe girl having a 45 minute ride to school, whereas before it only took 10 minutes. Go figure!
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Date: 5/1/2000 2:43:00 PM
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Author:
connie
(cmaem@hotmail.com)
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Subject:joe
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Joe has left the early childhood profession. He got a job in a factory at double the pay. We are going to miss him very much. (although I WANT his job) Today was fis 6 year anniversery at the day care. But when you have a family to support. I went to the centre to say good bye and all the children and there parents were sad. A couple of the mothers got one last flirt in with him too. He got a couple of bottles of wine and some candy. At his going away party he was getting a little misty.
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Date: 4/10/2000 6:48:00 PM
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Author:
Kaye
(kaye@moonbeams.co.nz)
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Subject:Males in E.C.
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Hi Craig. Interesting subject to be studying. I have worked with a few males, and as the Director, have employed a few. The most common forms of discrimination I have seen (and strived not to repeat) are: not allowing the male to toilet children or change nappies, often at parents' request. Always being the one doing the physical outdoor activities, including carrying children on their backs, which female workers would be discouraged from doing (because we all know the statistics about bad backs of C.C. workers)Assigned to 'typical' male play stations eg the carpentry table. Not being the one to put children to bed. Not being trusted to do the cleaning tasks properly.Being 'rescued' by a female co worker when dealing with toileting accidents. Being expected to do the repairs, or heavier tasks, sometimes outside of normal working hours.
In N.Z., after the much publisized Christchurch Creche closure after their male worker was convicted of sexual abuse (many E.C. workers still believe he was wrongly convicted) the National Assoc for Childcare put out guidelines for the protection of particularly male workers from wrongful accusation of abuse. These included observation windows into the toilet areas, no closed doors in the toilet areas, and never allowing any staff member to take children for walks alone. Clear employment policies that ensured checking references and doing police checks were also recommended. These guidelines were useful for male and female workers, and also served as ways to ensure that abuse was less likely to occur.
As an employer and trainer, I always warn prospective male workers of the discrimination, and brainstorm with them ways of making them feel safe and accepted. Often parents will question the wisdom of employing a male, which in itself is discrimination, but is maybe understandable considering the publicity that abuse cases have had all around the world. You are welcome to email me for specific comments. Good luck with your research.
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Date: 10/17/2000 7:34:00 AM
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Author:
Miss Erin
(mina_iscool@excite.com)
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Subject:hey! whats a nappie?
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sorry i have just never heard
that term before...nappie...
like taking a nap?
im gonna go take a nappie?
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Date: 4/14/2000 8:18:00 AM
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Author:
Kendra
(kendra@mail.earlychildhood.com)
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Subject:Joe
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Since Connie hasn't been for a while (and I'm her sister and fellow ece) I'll answer what I can on your questions about Joe.
We are in Canada in Ontario.
On occasion Joe is called to be the "man". If he is around when something needs to be done that would be commonly put as a man's job he'd do it. Examples: fixing plugged toilets and putting together new big toys like bikes or hockey nets. But in general us "girls" can do it without him.
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Date: 8/21/2000 4:46:00 PM
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Author:
John
(jasquared@yahoo.com)
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Subject:2 adult rule... handyman issues
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I am one of only 2 men that work at our school. I teach Pre-k 4. I couldn't agree more about the 2 adult rule. We use this rule at our church. No adult is allowed to go anywhere with a child by his or her self. Another adult is REQUIRED to go with them. This is for the safety of the child as well as the adult. It is ALWAYS a good idea to have another adult with you whenever possible. Especially when the situation could be uncomfortable (eg. bathroom, changing soiled clothes).
As for the handyman issue. I think it is expected that a man will help with the heavy stuff or repairing things. I don't know why it is that way, but it is. Whether it is right or not is not for me to decide. All I can say about it is the choice is yours buddy. Don't be afraid to say "no" if you feel uncomfortable about it. Then again, don't be afraid to step outside of your job description and say "yes" just to be a nice guy. :) Hope this helps.
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Date: 8/13/2002 10:03:00 PM
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Author:
Jesse
(ttu@bendcable.com)
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Subject:Safety Rules for Male Teachers and Directors
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Hello:
I am a male in the childcare industry. I have been in the industry since the 80's and have had fun doing it. It can be a challenging field, yet a very rewarding one as well. I now own a preschool and am the director.
I feel as the owner and director, I have an unfair advantage on most other male teachers. Many mothers and fathers in our area act up tight when I first do an interview or tour of our school. They are uptight until they find out I own the school. I think it is just the sterotyping of men in this field. There are good and bad male teachers just as females. However, I do have some rules that I follow and would advise any male teacher or director to follow as these rules have kept me in the field and without incident:
1.Never be in the school by yourself with students, like at closing time.
2.Never allow students to sit on you.
3.Never button up students clothing or pants, and never change dipers or do any potty training.
4.Always be outgoing and never reclusive.
5.Never say "I love you" back to students, but instead say that you like them as well.
There are more, but that is most of what I have lived by these past years. Good luck to all males in the field.
Jesse
www.tinytotsuniversity.com
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Date: 4/14/2000 2:24:00 AM
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Author:
Kaye
(kaye@moonbeams.co.nz)
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Subject:males in EC
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about the co - worker who told the parent that her child was the only passenger in a van with a male driver: I think the worker was right to do this. There are a couple of issues here, one is that the driver himself was in a position that put him at risk of false accusation, similar to anyone working alone with children in a building (as opposed to a vehicle)and this situation hopefully alerted him to that. Also, statistics reflect what actually happens, and whether we like it or not, the statistics clearly show that the majority of abuse is done by male adults who are in a position of trust. So, I think it was reasonable for that staff member to make the parent aware of the situation, even if only to give the parent the opportunity to make an informed choice.
I would suggest that the most unfortunate thing about this case is that the solution decided upon was probably not the most ideal for the child. If I was the parent, I would have at least wanted to be reassured that the driver was trustworthy. In this case, it does not need to be seen as prejudice against the male driver, so much as being sure that the child is safe. That is our responsibility as EC workers.
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Date: 4/21/2000 9:49:00 AM
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Author:
joe
(joearcher@earlychildhood.com)
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Subject:hey joe,
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hi,
I also am a male in the ece program and i am not throught the program yet but i have been put in many discriminating situations as well which i dont find particulary right. if the females can do everything, why cant we? they are saying we are discriminating against them in a "mans world" well here they are doinf it to us. not blaming anyone really i am just saying that if they can go out into the hard labour factory jobs why cant we go into a daycare and work?!?!
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Date: 4/21/2000 9:50:00 AM
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Author:
joe
(joearcher@earlychildhood.com)
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Subject:hey joe,
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hi,
I also am a male in the ece program and i am not throught the program yet but i have been put in many discriminating situations as well which i dont find particulary right. if the females can do everything, why cant we? they are saying we are discriminating against them in a "mans world" well here they are doinf it to us. not blaming anyone really i am just saying that if they can go out into the hard labour factory jobs why cant we go into a daycare and work?!?!
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Date: 4/30/2000 6:01:00 PM
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Author:
Judy
(servoss@vsta.com)
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Subject:Men in EC
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I am a new teacher but an older woman just finishing an education put on hold until my family was all raised and gone. I DO NOT like men in EC. We have a male aide and the 4-5 year olds are afraid of him, not that he is mean or anything. He has 2 daughters at Pre-K age even but the boys do not like him. I freely go into the restroom whether it is to help a male or female child but he cannot go help the girls--his feeling! I wipe and clean bottoms and wipe noses and kiss hurts all better, but he restricts himself to helping with class work. He is not my aide and I would have requested he not be if I were faced with a choice. He is a nice person but I just do not see this as a mans place. In high school, perhaps--even in the fifth grade, but not with the ones who need a person who is like a Mom, Granny, or Aunt--yes, woman. Most children this age need the male figures to be Dad's, coaches, or Principals. My thoughts, just my feelings.
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Date: 5/1/2000 4:00:00 PM
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Author:
Craig d'Arcy
(cd.sups.ecc@adlink.com.au)
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Subject:Men in EC
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Judy,
I respect your opinion and your thoughts, but I feel compelled to reply to you in what I hope to be a constructive way. The points I wish to make are as follows:
* Your comments do highlight for me the reasons behind my research, that is, we should not have males just because of their gender, but if they are the best person for the job. The same goes for females.
* Just because you have had a bad experience with one male worker does not mean that all males are bad. According to your logic, if there was a bad female worker, then all females should not work with children.That's crazy!!
* As a senior, trained staff member, you have a responsibility to challenge this worker to maintain a higher standard of care and teamwork. Working with children does not just mean the face to face care, but all of the other dynamics that ensures a quality programme e.g. teamwork, personal/professsional development, etc etc.
* Have you ever read of the value of male involvement in young children's lives ? I would see this as basic knowledge that all teachers should be aware of.
* My main concern is the effect your attitude would be having on the children. They are like sponges and would definitely be picking up on your negative vibes towards males. The ramifications would be for both boys and girls.
* I also wonder how the fathers involved in your programme would feel if made aware of your attitude. According to you, the dads who are actively involved in the care of their children should just give up, as they are not suitable. That is outrageous.
* I also wonder how other females in your workplace feel. You are placing women as just child carers, and are perpetuating the feminist struggle - that they should not be in positions of power e.g. coach, principal (your words).
* In your second last point you stated that males should not be with "the ones who need a person who is like a Mom, Granny, or Aunt". How the hell do you know if a particular child only needs a female role model?
* " It is part of being human to care for our young" (Levine, 1978) Don't ever forget that!!
* Thankyou for your response to this message board, it will be very useful for my research.
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Date: 5/1/2000 5:53:00 PM
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Author:
Judy
(servoss@vsta.com)
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Subject:Males
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Levine 1978?? Me 2000, I know men have the right to do any job a woman does. Is he a role model just because he is in the role of educator? Will lil boys want to grow up to be a teacher like Mr. Craig in Pre-K--NO, they will not nor will they use Mrs. Judy as a role model in later years. Tell me about your Levine 1978. Was he speaking of men? Women have the instincts to care for any young, not just their own. You just have more work to do as I see it. JUDY
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Date: 5/10/2000 12:39:00 AM
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Author:
Jamie (Male)
(jamiecrum@yahoo.com)
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Subject:male
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Craig,
I am a male and I work in California as a special ed. teacher for three to five-year-olds in the local school district. I am not gay. I HAVE MANY STORIES I COULD SHARE both favoring and discriminating against me in employment. Often I hear, "Oh its SO nice to have men in EC... all those single moms, you know.." as if that is all we have to offer. (Laugh) I must admit that doors have been opened easier for me than my female cohorts. It is never very long until someone new i work with asks me when I plan on going into administration. I am still completeing my masters in EC special ED and I am assumed as the specialist in tough district / parent relationships involving much better qualified and more experienced female teachers. I guess there are worse things to complain about!!
The washroom situation is very complex. I have two female assistants with whom I work. We all make sure that all toileting and dressing is done with another staff present, just to be safe for everyone. It's just good policy. I also tell my parents during the first home visit - "We all take turns in helping the students with their adaptive needs, including toileting and dressing. (for students often have these on their IEP goals in my room.) If you are not comfortable with me or any of my staff in this area, please let me know, now, or as the concern arises. We will make accomidations." Usualy parents say, "No problem." where i reply, "Darn, (laugh)I thought I might get out of toileting some of the kids!" which helps to lighten the often uncomfortable conversation.
I dont have my assistants perform any duties i wouldn't do my self.
I have a teacher student ratio of 1:5 in this program. when other teachers are hired the district hires an assistant when the class reaches an enrollment of 6. When I was hired to start this program, they hired a female assistant immediately, which was previously unheard of.
Again, a nice problem to have!
Nice topic,
jamie
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Date: 5/10/2000 12:58:00 AM
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Author:
Jamie (Male)
(jamiecrum@yahoo.com)
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Subject:I can out nurture..
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Hey Craig,
I just posted an earlier message before reading all the notes.
i would like to add.....
I am pretty tired of hearing- men aren't able to be nurturing to all children, blah, blah....
Five bucks, a game of bowling, and a pack of smokes says I can out nurture Judy!
sorry, I let my insensitive masculine side take over....
But seriously, I have met some very insensitive women who wouldn't stop and get down on a childs level and listen to their nightmares, or ask about the child's dreams, hopes or worries. I consider myself a darn efficient wipper of noses and bottoms. I also consider myself a professional having the knowledge of, and appreciation for, the social - emotional development of preschoolers, which makes me concious of my need to nurture my students and not be affraid to hug them every day they walk through that door!
so there judy.
signed,
jamie from California
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Date: 8/14/2002 4:40:00 PM
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Author:
Michael
(mahroww@yahoo.com)
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Subject:No, not MICHELE...
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You get an "amen" for nuturing males. If I am allowed to say that. You forgot to add that Judy is too old and senile to properly care for children.
I can be serious too...We can sit here and ignore people like Judy or we can choose to do something about it. It takes a lot for a man to admit that he's nuturing let alone shout it out to EVERYONE and HAVE to prove it. I am just starting out in the business and it's nice to know I am not alone!
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Date: 5/12/2000 7:24:00 PM
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Author:
Brian
(Wanderingdragon1@Hotmail.Com)
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Subject: Hi, everybody; my name is Brian, other...
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Hi, everybody; my name is Brian, otherwise known periodically as "Mommy". I'm an Infant/Toddler teacher ... a 51-year-old male Infant/Toddler teacher ... the only male Infant/Toddler teacher I know of (but I sure would appreciate hearing from others!) This nuturing thing ... I have found that I nurture differently from my female colleagues. I don't have as much trouble with the "Oh what a cute little baby" syndrome that interfers with seeing infants as individuals rather than some form of super doll. As far as being treated differently because I'm a male, it happens all the time. When I was still in college, I went to work as a substitute TA in the child development centers of San Diego Unified School District. My first day I was told I couldn't monitor bathrooms, change toddlers, or diaper babies, and that there had to be a female teacher in the room at all times. California's Fair Employment and Housing Department took care of that, though, and that school district has changed its discriminatory policies. After college, the first place I worked my supervisor told me my voice was too loud and booming to work with babies. (That stopped when I pointed out to her that the timber of my voice was deeper than the other teachers, who were females, and so stood out more.) The point is, if a policy would be discriminatory if it applies to female teachers, it is discriminatory if it applies to males.
Yeah, I've been used as the Mr. Fixit, and periodic attempts have been made to make me The Enforcer ... but that only happens if I let it happen ... and I don't.
Today I was out on the playground, and some kids came up to me with a piece of chalk. They wanted me to draw beards and mustaches just like mine on their faces. That's the kind of thing I love about my work.
Hang in there, Craig, and if I ever meet you I'll shout you a pint, mate!
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Date: 5/16/2000 6:01:00 PM
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Author:
Craig
(cd.sups.ecc@adlink.com.au)
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Subject:The boys are back in town!!!
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To all those big beefy champion blokes with beards, tattoos (like me) and hairy body parts, but with the nurturing skills, who have been replying to my message I want to say a big thankyou. Good on youse ! My grammar tends to become somewhat erratic when I start talking to guys! Sorry.
I wish that we could work together, (with other females too), but especially with my arch nemesis Judy. We could show her the right stuff ! Bring it on. We could out programme, out teamwork, out nurture that silly silly woman. She's not gonna make it! Especially when the dads who take an active interest in caring for their children find out about her attitude.
Anyway, I just felt like getting some things off my hairy chest. I'll probably be banned from this site now, for not being politically correct, but I'll go down fighting!
Bye now. I'm off to the pub.
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Date: 5/19/2000 6:36:00 AM
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Author:
Brian
(Wanderingdragon1@Hotmail.Com)
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Subject:Cool. Have a pint for me! The fight go...
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Cool. Have a pint for me! The fight goes on. Yesterday I was ever so politely told by my director that I would have to leave my windows uncovered during the day because some parents were concerned and wanted to make sure they could look in. Too bad she wouldn't tell me who they were ... I could have alleviated their concerns (or shoved their teeth down their throats for implying I'm a pederast, either one, and I'm not too sure which.) The only good thing about that was that all the teachers uncovered their windows yesterday ... what's good for the gander is good for the goose, what? Have a good one. - Brian
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Date: 5/19/2000 8:23:00 PM
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Author:
Kaye
(kaye@moonbeams.co.nz)
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Subject:males in EC
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goodness Craig, what have you started?! I think you win the prize for the letter that generates the most interesting discussion!
I was one of the first to reply to you, and I've followed the discussion with interest, had lots of laughs and even been moved to clap a couple of times. The chest beating as you guys go off to the pub is strictly tongue in cheek,I know,(though it backs up a very strong point), but today I feel the need to highlight a point I originally made.
Statistics (so far) show that children are more likely to be abused by men than by women, and parents are right to want to protect their children from such horrors. Important also is the fact that EC workers, men and women, need to protect themselves from wrongful accusation, by not putting themselves in a vulnerable situation. In Brian's case, if some parents had voiced their concerns about the windows, the Director was right to act upon those concerns. The most sensible solution was of course, what actually happened, that all the windows were uncovered. This is about children's safety, not only about discimination against men. Stand up to wrongful discrimination, without letting it cloud the most important issue here - that of the safety of the children in your care. Taking a parent's concern personally rather than re acting to it professionally, will not further what is a vital cause: attracting and retaining men in the field of EC. Keep up the good work.
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Date: 5/20/2000 12:42:00 PM
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Author:
Brian
(Wanderingdragon1@Hotmail.Com)
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Subject:Males In ECC
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Statistics can (and do) show almost anything the statistician wants to show. The ones that say children are in more danger from males than females are particularly suspect. In my Child Abuse class in college, a postal inspector who has been fighting child pornography for over 20 years told us that he thinks the danger is about equal, but for various cultural reasons child sexual abuse by women is underreported ... for instance, a young male who is indoctrinated sexually by an older woman is considered to be lucky, while a female of the same age indoctrinated by an older male is considered to be raped.
So, all the professional organizations like NAEYC say we want more males in Early Childhood Education, and (obviously) I agree with that. The children need male nurturing and role modeling just as much as they need female nurturing and role modeling. It's a 50/50 need, and many of them simply aren't getting it, with resulting problems in adolescence. So what, female colleagues, are you offering both the men already in ECC and the men we are trying to recruit? Let me suggest that countenancing the unfounded fears and perceptions of parents that I am more likely to sexually abuse the children in my charge than my team teacher, who is a young female, is certainly not going to keep me in the field and is definitly not going to attract other men. As dedicated as I am, and as much as I absolutely love working with young children, I am simply not going to tolerate having to go all day in a defensive posture. If my female colleagues are not going to defend me and educate parents, then I suggest that the stated need for males in the field is simply lip service to gender equality and nothing more, and that we men who have dedicated our lives to young children probably need to go somewhere where we are not automatically suspect just because we're men.
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Date: 5/20/2000 2:38:00 PM
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Author:
Jamie (Male)
(jamiecrum@yahoo.com)
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Subject:lets not sound too militant guys!!
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OK men, don't loose your sense of humor now. I am as concerned about my families' concerns with my intentions as the next person. I think that families who dump their children off in childcare to go and chase the dollar have a lot of guilt associated with that. (Note the heated use of terms to spark more discussion!) Who else are they going to take their abuse out on but men?? We're the only group left who people can gang up on and not feel as if they have crossed to politcal incorrectness. Parents in my mind should feel skeptical about the people caring for their children. (regardles of the workers sex.) I have seen plenty unprofessional teachers and staff who's personality turns 180% as soon as the parent leaves the room.
I won't tolerate this in my program - for it's an intense 3hrs a day and we are always "engaged" with our "friends", due to their special needs in all areas of development.
Ive always had the feeling that people who are quick to judge nurturing men who love to play and interact with men, must have had an inadequate male figure in their past.
When I see a man lying on the floor, playing with a small child - I remember my dad and uncle playing with me. It makes me feel great and brings back many warm, loving memories. (hows that for nuturing!?)
For someone else to see the same man and child then thinks, "woah-somethings wrong - must be a molester." or" that looks weird!" sends out some red flags- whats this person's idea of a dad? moreover, someone who makes the statement, "men can't nurture and shouldn't work in ec." gives me the same red flags. Or, i just think.... their old.
Bottom line men, .....
be a man, quit whining and go be better, more professional, fun care providers. be goofey with your kids. Model how proficient and competent you are rather than demanding others see you that way.
jamie in California
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Date: 5/20/2000 2:53:00 PM
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Author:
Jamie (Male)
(jamiecrum@yahoo.com)
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Subject:know what women in ec cant do?...
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I have seen very few women that are good at extending dramatic play for boys. they usualy limit the dramatic play to the stupid little kitchen area.
Come on lady's have you heard of a "TRUCK VOICE"?
First, you have to get your voice down real low and scratchy. Next, get out the helecopters, trucks and cars. build a fort and assign names like jake, fred and chase to the characters. say stuff like, "COME ON JAKE, GET IN THE CHOPPER BEFORE THE WORLD EXPLODES!" and, "THANKS BUTCH, THAT WAS A CLOSE ONE!" HOP IN AND FOLLOW ME" pretending to fly away......
thats something that women don't usualy bring to the ec classroom.
there, take that!
Jamie from CA
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Date: 3/3/2002 9:00:00 AM
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Author:
april
(aprilallen1@netscape.net)
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Subject:males in ec
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there are three males at the community school where i work. when i started working there i thought that it was strange to see men working with 6week old to 5year old children. Now i see that i was wrong. i have never seen three guys more caring about children then these three. some times you can watch them and wounder why they are there but when you see them with these children you hope they never leave and go work somewhere else. These three men do better with these children then some of the female teachers that i have worked with .
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Date: 5/20/2000 8:30:00 PM
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Author:
Brian
(Wanderingdragon1@Hotmail.Com)
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Subject:Men in ECE and Professionalism
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Whining's one thing ... addressing a legitimate concern is another. Of course the parents are going to have guilt problems and are going to react to the media drum beat typifying men-as-abusers. As a professional, I expect that. But I expect the other professionals in my field to help me as I educate the parents, not react to their fears and prejudices.
Know what else women in ECE can't do? They can't let the kids feel their beards and then have them feel the tops of their own heads so they know beards are just hair growing in another place. Neither can they let an infant or toddler cuddle up against their beards while being rocked to sleep.
But you know what all of us can do? We can accept that men and women nurture kids in different styles, and that the kids need both styles to adequately develop into whole human beings.
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Date: 5/22/2000 5:22:00 PM
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Author:
Craig
(cd.sups.ecc@adlink.com.au)
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Subject:Males in EC
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This hornet's nest that I've stirred up makes for a bloody good read - let's keep it going!
I can only hope that my friend Judy is taking an active interest in the discussion. GRRRRRR
Well, I just want to say that us men cannot be too militant or aggressive in our stance, but we need to just keep plugging away by being good role models and to challenge attitudes whenever the situation arises. That way the people we affect will only spread the word positively.
Anyway, when I read Brian's last paragraph I said BINGO ! out loud. The crux of the whole discussion centres on the fact that women and men nurture kids in different ways, and that children need to have positives from both genders to develop into whole people. Brian's statement almost bought a tear to my eye (that's my sensitive side coming out) Pass the tissues Judy.
It is part of being human to care for our young.
Also, one more point, don't take negative criticism or negative attitudes personally. Take it professionally and it will work out for the best. I had two children come to a centre I was working at been sexually abused in a home based care, by the husband of the carer. the parents had highlighted on their enrolment form that "under no circumstances if there is a male working at this centre, are they to be involved in any way with the care of our children..." i had to understand their point of view and not take this as a personal attack. To cut a long story short, I became the most trusted carer for those parents, who told me that I had done the best job with their children out of all the staff. I had to slowly build up their trust and build a strong relationship with those parents. This was years ago and I still run across those parents every now and then - we stop to have a chat. my point is that we have to remain professional. It's difficult to do but is worth all the effort. This is also the case when we have personal values clouding our judgement e.g. if the child comes from a gay household. we are at the forefront of moulding in some way the attitudes of the children that we care for, it's a big responsibility where we need the right people for the job. Not just males for males' sake, or females for females sake.
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Date: 11/20/2000 5:29:00 PM
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Author:
jennifer - australia
(jmdkeyt@yahoo.co.uk)
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Subject:males in EC
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I totally agree - some women can't get down and play with trucks, trains and planes comfortably (unless they did that as a child). Not many females play footy with the boys or rough and tumble either. I would love to work with a male in a centre because it would be totally different as to working with a female. With so many single families, children need to know a supportive, trusted male in their lives.
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Date: 11/20/2000 5:30:00 PM
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Author:
jennifer - australia
(jmdkeyt@yahoo.co.uk)
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Subject:males in EC
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I totally agree - some women can't get down and play with trucks, trains and planes comfortably (unless they did that as a child). Not many females play footy with the boys or rough and tumble either. I would love to work with a male in a centre because it would be totally different as to working with a female. With so many single families, children need to know a supportive, trusted male in their lives.
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Date: 11/20/2000 5:31:00 PM
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Author:
jennifer - australia
(jmdkeyt@yahoo.co.uk)
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Subject:males in EC
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I totally agree - some women can't get down and play with trucks, trains and planes comfortably (unless they did that as a child). Not many females play footy with the boys or rough and tumble either. I would love to work with a male in a centre because it would be totally different as to working with a female. With so many single families, children need to know a supportive, trusted male in their lives.
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Date: 5/22/2000 6:25:00 PM
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Author:
Judy
(servoss@vsta.com)
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Subject:What did I say to get a BEE in the 2 of ...
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What did I say to get a BEE in the 2 of your bonnets? I just voiced my feelings and beliefs which in no way was a personal
attack to anyone. My lil ones enjoy role play and I never limit and YES encourage them to be anything they want. My lil (boy)
Albert wants to be the Princess and all the girls have been Police, race car drivers, firefighters, Doctors, and even Batman (I
make costumes for role play). The boys don't want to be Mother's, Queen's, Fairy Godpersons, secretaries, nurses, but I
make sure they know the latter two are done very well by males. We are just a bit behind the times here. I have gotten a rise
out of you all and enjoy how personal you seem to take opinions of others. Hang in there. I am a very good, yes great Early
Childhood Educator. My pupils all know I love them with all my heart, no one can out nurture the BEST MOM EVER on
earth and friend that's ME! I truly care, not just 7:45 to 3:30. Nurture is my nature and don't question my ability without
knowing 1st hand!! Thanks for the laughs.
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Date: 5/22/2000 6:29:00 PM
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Author:
Judy
(servoss@vsta.com)
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Subject:I do not smoke or bowl but Id love the $...
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I do not smoke or bowl but I'd love the $5.00. I win, you lost before you were born.
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Date: 5/22/2000 9:03:00 PM
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Author:
kaye
(kaye@moonbeams.co.nz)
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Subject:males in EC
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congratulations Judy, you've just added at least 3 pages to Craig's research.
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Date: 5/23/2000 5:21:00 PM
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Author:
Craig
(cd.sups.ecc@adlink.com.au)
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Subject:Males in EC
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Thanks for the support Kaye ! You champion. I also want to give a big thanks to Judy Servoss, for basically writing my research presentation for me. Your comments are GOLD! In my first posting, I mentioned that I wanted to use people's responses for a national (Australian) conference for early Childhood professionals, to be held in October. Judy, you're gonna be famous! People in EC from all over Australia are going to hear all about your wacky antics. And as for the $5, I'll give it to you in Australian dollars, it will only be worth about $2.60. As for getting personal, why don't you post the two personal messages you sent me via my e.mail so that everyone can read them - or won't you fully stand behind your principles ? All the very best - keep it coming.
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Date: 5/23/2000 5:23:00 PM
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Author:
Craig
(cd.sups.ecc@adlink.com.au)
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Subject:Males in EC
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Thanks for the support Kaye ! You champion. I also want to give a big thanks to Judy Servoss, for basically writing my research presentation for me. Your comments are GOLD! In my first posting, I mentioned that I wanted to use people's responses for a national (Australian) conference for early Childhood professionals, to be held in October. Judy, you're gonna be famous! People in EC from all over Australia are going to hear all about your wacky antics. And as for the $5, I'll give it to you in Australian dollars, it will only be worth about $2.60. As for getting personal, why don't you post the two personal messages you sent me via my e.mail so that everyone can read them - or won't you fully stand behind your principles ? All the very best - keep it coming.
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Date: 6/1/2000 8:18:00 PM
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Author:
Theresa
(panda@kscable.com)
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Subject:males in ec
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Hi from Kansas. I have been a pre-school teacher for 11 years. I have my master's degree in Elem. Ed with an Emphasis in EC. We have 4 males working on our staff of 50. 2 of them just graduated from high school and work with the afterschool program. 1 is a parent (who has been an assistant and sub.) and the other is the superviser of the after school program. I have personally worked with the latter two in my classroom. I have enjoyed working with them both. Not only do I expect them to be nurtuning to the children but, I also expect them to help with the cleaning duties. I have even had parents ask if one of them does babysitting. And, guess what...he does. The children love having the males in the classroom they are a terrific model for the children...and we have never had any issues of complants from the parents just because they are males. I will admit though, that when they are in my room I do ask them to carry heavy items up two flights of steps for me. I have a bad muscle in my back. I have always done it myself before this. So, when it comes right down to it...I believe that it just comes down to attitudes and expectations. I have the same attitude and expectations from the guys as I do the gals. With either one...I don't ask them to do anything I would not do myself. If a parent has a concern I think we can say that we hear what they are saying...but that we back our teachers...male or female. If the concern needs to be researched then do it. Don't back up the parent just because it is a male teacher. Anyways, that's my 2 cents. Good luck at your conference!
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Date: 6/11/2000 3:29:00 AM
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Author:
Belinda
(belinda_dene@hotmail.com)
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Subject:Hi my name is Belinda and i am an Early ...
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Hi my name is Belinda and i am an Early Childhood Teacher in New Zealand. I had 4 Males in my Course at Teachers College and while out in the field with several males. In my experience all of the males were treated in the same way as the female staff, this included toileting and nappy changing. In the centre where I work at present we do not have a male teacher but are in the process of employing one as all 5 female staff members feel that it is very important for the children to have a male in there lives that they can trust. Many of our children come from single parent families where they live with there mums and hardly ever and sometimes not at all see their fathers. Our staff have approached our Manager and asked to have a male staff member brought in. Judy's comments were very negitive and she seems to think that she is perfect in every way reality check Judy YOUR NOT!!! no one is. As for the issue on nurturing, a male is just as if not more nurturing to children if I look back to my childhood it was always a male rolling around the floor with me not a female. Craig your point about children being like sponges and picking up on the negitive vibes is so true children always pick up on these vibes and it can be damaging for them. I think that the sooner more males are introduced into Early Childhood the better off our younger generations are going to be. One last thing to Judy you think you are the best mom ever then I guess you better take another look at yourself cause im guessing that there are many people that will disagree espically with the negitive attitude that you carry.
So to all you guys out there keep up the good work and keep fighting cause there are many of us out here that want to work with male teachers and also good luck with the seminar Craig.
A Male Teacher Supporter
Belinda
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Date: 6/11/2000 3:29:00 AM
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Author:
Belinda
(belinda_dene@hotmail.com)
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Subject:males in earlychildhood
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Hi my name is Belinda and i am an Early Childhood Teacher in New Zealand. I had 4 Males in my Course at Teachers College and while out in the field with several males. In my experience all of the males were treated in the same way as the female staff, this included toileting and nappy changing. In the centre where I work at present we do not have a male teacher but are in the process of employing one as all 5 female staff members feel that it is very important for the children to have a male in there lives that they can trust. Many of our children come from single parent families where they live with there mums and hardly ever and sometimes not at all see their fathers. Our staff have approached our Manager and asked to have a male staff member brought in. Judy's comments were very negitive and she seems to think that she is perfect in every way reality check Judy YOUR NOT!!! no one is. As for the issue on nurturing, a male is just as if not more nurturing to children if I look back to my childhood it was always a male rolling around the floor with me not a female. Craig your point about children being like sponges and picking up on the negitive vibes is so true children always pick up on these vibes and it can be damaging for them. I think that the sooner more males are introduced into Early Childhood the better off our younger generations are going to be. One last thing to Judy you think you are the best mom ever then I guess you better take another look at yourself cause im guessing that there are many people that will disagree espically with the negitive attitude that you carry.
So to all you guys out there keep up the good work and keep fighting cause there are many of us out here that want to work with male teachers and also good luck with the seminar Craig.
A Male Teacher Supporter
Belinda
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Date: 6/20/2000 12:24:00 PM
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Author:
Karen
(bkpummill@hotmail.com)
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Subject:males in E.C.
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I started in the early childhood field about 13 years ago. I was hired as an assistant for a teacher named David. He was outstanding!!!!!He had a great sense of humor with the staff and with the children. He got down on the childrens level and really put his heart into his job! He is the reason that I got into the field. He taught me so much about child development and always encouraged the staff to further their personal development by reading books etc. I am now teaching a three 3 old preschool class and loving it. I think back to David often and use many of the ideas that I learned in the toddler house.
Also about the windows being covered. I never understood that and didn't like ANY teachers covering their windows. Makes me wonder what they are hiding. I think it is a good policy for classrooms to be accessible to parents and teachers at all times for visiting and viewing. Just keeps everything on the up and up. Keep up the good work!
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Date: 6/22/2000 10:20:00 PM
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Author:
Peggy
(PeggySue48@aol.com)
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Subject:Craig You really started a very interes...
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Craig
You really started a very interesting conversation! I am a director of school-age child care and have had many males working with me. Right now my Lead Teacher (like assistant director) is a male. Since the children are older I have not had problems with possible abuse concerns from parents. However, I never leave one staff alone with children. Just not a wise thing...a safety and licensening issue!
Just wanted to throw out an aspect that has not been addressed and perhaps may appear self-serving, but is a valid point. The pay in this field is low! Many issues like professionalism, public atitude changes, etc. are needed to raise the pay. I think more men in the field will also help raise the level of pay. I have lost great male employees because they got married, wanted to buy a house, or etc and just couldn't on the pay in our field.
Comments!
PeggySue
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Date: 6/23/2000 8:05:00 AM
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Author:
Judy
(servoss@vsta.com)
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Subject:Males in ECE and pay
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I know Peggy Sue is a smart lady, it all boils down to pay!! I am taking a job that pays nearly two thousand dollars a year less due to the fact I am relocating and in South Texas the pay was higher for me. In North Texas there is not so much FREE and given. I won't even have an aide. I now see a real need to recruit males in ECE so we can all get the pay teachers have always deserved and never gotten.
To tell the truth I went into education to fulfill a life long dream and it is nice to get that paycheck but I honestly do it for the pleasure it brings. I will slowly repay my college loans (they were not available when I quit school thinking I'd never get an education), I will live a little lesss extravagant (we just bought a smaller home), and I will have what makes me happy (small children around to love and care for).
Teachers are a hard working lot, male and female. I was very fond of all the male teachers in Jr. High and High School. They were the only male role models in our lives since we were from a single parent home. Their wifes were our EC teachers and we all went to the same churches (we went to several to get well rounded). We knew our teachers because they were part of our community. No one goes into education for the money--never have and never will. I see my old teachers at reunions (all have retired since I am near retirement age myself) and many have died and I felt the loss as well as a family member. My 6th grade teacher is 96 and was an old lady, we thought, when she taught us. I see her about 4-6 times a year and I love her. Money is nice, but will never be the main concern.
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Date: 6/29/2000 10:27:00 AM
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Author:
Laurie
(guyer@net1plus.com)
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Subject:males in ec
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I am the mother of 3 sons, ages 5, 3, and 1. I also am the family child care provider of 5 boys, ranging in age from 3 to 10. So I am surrounded by boys, and do my best to show them an unbiased view of the world. I must say, my husband was sexually molested as a boy. He is very leary of men being around our sons. Personally I think males in EC are great! My boys love it when their uncle or other males are around, they love to play with them. I know a man who is a local preschool teacher. He has been in the field for 20 years, and owns and operates a preschool. I want to send my 3 y o to him, but hubby is leary. I know the man, and he is wonderful. Any advice on how to qualm hubbys fears?
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Date: 7/9/2000 3:30:00 PM
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Author:
john
(dskelly@cfl.rr.com)
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Subject:men in EC
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It is great to know that there are other guys out their in
the feild.
I am the director of a center in Florida. I have been here for 3 years. i am very fortunate that the Mother & Daughter
team that own the center, took me in. I started out as the school age teacher and quickly moved in to the director position. Being here has helped me be able to go to school for my AS in Early Childhood Education. There was never a question about me being in the center.
As for the people who do not think men should be in EC I say,they are wrong. I get more attention from the children at times that my female staff. you hear them yell for me, from the playgound before I even get out of my car in the moring. It is a pleasure to touch the lifes of the children in my center, many whom come from single parent families.
we are roll models for every child we come in contact with. we need more of us out their, giving it our all.
john
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Date: 7/9/2000 5:09:00 PM
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Author:
Erin
(Ern493@cs.com)
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Subject:men can be wonderful in Daycares
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I work for a man that owns a small center. I love it. He is as nurturing as any female. The boys really look up to him it is wonderful. He is like a child at heart.
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Date: 7/17/2000 1:21:00 PM
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Author:
Tom
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Subject:males in early ed
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Date: 7/19/2000 3:53:00 PM
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Author:
Yvette
(ycole@bellatlantic.net)
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Subject:males in ec
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Working in a system where most of the children do not have a male role model,I would LOVE to have a man working with me. It's always a treat when we get a male volunteer...for boys and girls. I once worked with a male student doing an internship. I thought we really represented a solid chuck of America-Black women & White male. We balanced each other out.
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Date: 7/23/2000 11:40:00 PM
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Author:
Anthony
(wonderboi41@hotmail.com)
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Subject:judys comments
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Hi all
I am new to this so i'll give it the best I can. Judy your comments have stood out. i am intersted in your interpretation of the role of the educator eg quasi mum role model to children. This, i believe is not your role or the role of any other practitioners. Parents are not to be replaced by professionals who are payed to care for children. Without the parent/s consent of taking over their role, i feel you have crossed the line of professionalism (Mother theresa like role). You label your work as 'love, care' etc, i'm worried about such terminology being used in relation to our work with children. Your comments and generalisations about men seem to be uninformed and incomplete, your narrow minded view about the role of EC educators seems to based on a long term ambition to 'save the children', I suggest Judy that you do some sole searching and refocus on the issues of working with young children as an educator rather than a saviour.
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Date: 8/4/2000 6:45:00 AM
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Author:
Brian
(b51jk@excite.com)
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Subject:Males etc.
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Doesn't anybody out there realize that children need BOTH forms of nourishment ... male and female? Too many single-parent families, too many fathers and mothers battling without thinking of the kids. Get it together, people ... the kids need all of us combined, not this male-female stuff.
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Date: 8/4/2000 12:45:00 PM
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Author:
Rae
(raeh@hotmail.com)
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Subject:I thinks its ridiculous to say that men ...
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I thinks its ridiculous to say that men and women can do an equal job in child care. What I think is more appropriate to say is that women bring something special to the early childhood field that men cannot. And men bring something special to the early childhood field that women can not. We need good people from both genders to give our children the most solid foundation for the rest of their lives.
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Date: 8/23/2000 5:58:00 PM
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Author:
Jenny
(jennyl@bettanet.net.au)
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Subject:Males in Early Childhood
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I really aoppreciated this discussion and especially your comment Rae. I work in a team with four women and one man. I find that our unique abilities and personalities work together wonderfully and create a fun, creative, nuturing, exciting and educational environment for the children.
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Date: 8/23/2000 5:59:00 PM
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Author:
Jenny
(jennyl@bettanet.net.au)
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Subject:Males in Early Childhood
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I really appreciated this discussion and especially your comment Rae. I work in a team with four women and one man. I find that our unique abilities and personalities work together wonderfully to create a fun, creative, nuturing, exciting and educational environment for the children.
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Date: 8/16/2000 1:07:00 AM
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Author:
Henare
(whanau@K04B028.kohanga.ac.nz)
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Subject:Network for Males
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Henare
Re: Early Childhood conference for Males in Early Childhood
I am a Male Kaiako in the Kohanga (Maori early childhood centre) named above, I have been involved in early childhood since 1996. I have attended various early childhood Hui (meetings), however none that are solely for Males in early childhood.
I am looking for assistance in establishing a Hui for Males, whether it's a networking support system, Hui, or support group. I am not sure where to start and have been contacting various organisations/ people. Where to from here? I am not sure, if you are interested you can contact me here.
Kia Ora Anö
Henare Gurney (Kaiako/Supervisor)
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Date: 7/22/2005 11:08:00 AM
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Author:
desperate mom
(hiawathakid@yahoo.com)
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Subject:Males in Early Childhood
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Hi, I just found this board and wanted to comment that we need more males in this field. One of the best Master Teachers that I worked with when I was a student teacher was a male. In this world of single mothers, they are great role models.
Cheryl
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Date: 8/22/2000 3:52:00 AM
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Author:
anthony
(anthonysemann@hotmail.com.au)
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Subject:male network
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Hi
In sydney Australia, we have a males in early childhood network group which was established about 5 years ago. We have approx 110 people in our group. I am happy to send to you any information if you wish.
Cheers
Anthony
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Date: 8/22/2000 3:55:00 AM
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Author:
anthony
(anthonysemann@hotmail.com.au)
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Subject:male network
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Hi
In sydney Australia, we have a males in early childhood network group which was established about 5 years ago. We have approx 110 people in our group. I am happy to send to you any information if you wish.
Cheers
Anthony
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Date: 8/25/2000 4:04:00 PM
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Author:
Shell
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Subject:I think having males in daycares and sch...
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I think having males in daycares and schools is wonderful. So many times we are working with children who don't have a strong and sensitive male in their lives. It's very sad because the boys don't have positive role models to show them how to deal with all the crazy things life throws at them and then their are the girls who grow up and don't know how to choose a good partner because they've never had a male who exhibits all the wonderful qualities men have that are unique to men. Men are naturally logical and I appreciate having a male to bounce ideas off of or to problem solve with because many times my emotions have gotten involved and I'm not seeing the problem clearly. God bless all you men in early childhood education
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Date: 9/9/2000 6:46:00 PM
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Author:
Elizabeth
(ecarr2nd@home.com)
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Subject:Hello, My name is Elizabeth Carr and...
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Hello,
My name is Elizabeth Carr and i live in Birmingham, AL, USA. I was searching the net for ideas to teach kids about elections and campaigning when I stumbled onto your site. I teach 2nd grade in a low income areea. MY brother, bryan, used to teach with me. He recently became engaged and felt that in order to raise a family he needed to make more money. He thought originally thay he'd like to move up and become a principal or other administrator. But after seeing all the craop they have to do and loving the classroom so much, he knew he'd be unhappy when he had to leave it. He was also unhappy to see friends of his in the business world making the same or less money than he did have such huge possibilies for advancement without further degrees and thousands of dollars in bonuses and incentives available to them. The only way for him to make more money and sty in the classroom was to pay tuition and attend graduate school to recieve his masters degree. He was not ready or willing to do this. He loved teaching so much and he was so talented and gifted in the field. I am four years older than he, so his 1st year of teaching was my 5th. We taught at the same school and most days it was wonderful. Yes, he too was the "handyman". In fact, I was affected by this too. ONe example is before school started, we were both working in our own classrooms. He was in a trailer, or portable classroom and had tons of work to do. I was helping him as much as i could but i had my own sclassroom and students to prepare for. Anyway, my principal saw him walking empty handed to my classroom and shoved a bucket of paint and a brush in his hand and asked him, expected him to paint the handrail of the steps on the side of the school. So, being a first year, untenured teacher, he happily agreeeed. But his room wasn't ready and the first day of school was rapidly approaching. /Did his room get ready? Of course! Iwas down there painting myself and i assure you i was mad as a hornet and cussing like a sailor. I worked in his room while he painted, whent to the local lawn care cewnter and picked up loads of mulch and spread in in natural areas around the school. Stuff like that happened all year and I think it bothered me more than it did him. He was the only other male in the school besides the principal. So a lot of teachers whold send behavior problems to him. He would get frustrated with this because it interrupted his teaching time with his class. Kids were in and out of there all day. And when it got to be too much, where did the kids go? Not back to their own classrooms, but to mine. So my kid's instructional time was interrupted too. Well, I have ranted and raved enough about the abuse of male teachers, haven't I?
Currently, Bryan is frustrated because he doesn't have a job. He is working with a friend cutting and maintaining a local high school's fields. He is interviewing for different positions. He will take a substantial cut in pay but the possibilities for advancement are much, much, greater. He decided to do thes now, while he is young enough to come back to education if he is not happy in the "business world." He is missed. And it is a tremedous loss to the education profession. But greater than that, it is a loss to the children whom he love, believed in, and inspired.
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Date: 9/10/2000 6:36:00 PM
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Author:
annoyed
(POST ONLY ONCE)
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Subject:Please post only once!!!!!!...
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Please post only once!!!!!!
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Date: 9/12/2000 5:01:00 AM
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Author:
Bill
(arkangelbs@mail.com)
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Subject:Early Childhood Specialist
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Hey everyone. My name is Bill. I am an Early Childhood Development Specialist in Arkansas. I am working on my third year teaching the 3 1/2 to 4 year olds at a clinic that deals with children with developmental delays and a medical diagnosis. I have never felt discriminated against as a teacher. The bathroom situation was the only warning I was given when I first started. I was told it would be in my best interest to not go to the bathroom alone and change any girls, but boys were o.k. My Administrator told me this not out of a plan to protect the children in my care, but to protect me from ever being in a situation that could cast any doubt as to what I was doing. I made the concious decision to not go to the bathroom alone with any children. No adult goes to change alone. That way the child is protected, as well as myself.
I have been complimented several times by peers and parents in how great it is that their child have a positive male role model in their lives. The type of children we have are all low income, and come from many single family homes. I do not agree with what the one lady said about thinking that men can not provide the same kind of care and nurturing as women. When I go out in the morning play time, I am bombarded by children (my class and others). They want their morning hug and "good morning". I have observed that this does not happen that often when the female teachers enter the play area. I get down on the kids level; give them plenty of hugs, kisses, and attention. Any one can look at these children, and see they are so starved for attention. (Especially male attention). I am very thankful for being given the chance to do my job. If there was any discrimination I feel, as a male Early Childhood teacher, is that it is much harder to get into a public teaching position where I am from. I looked for a teaching position in and around the area I live for more than 4 years before I finally tried for this job. So, for the chance to do what I love, I travel over 80 miles (one way) to my job.
I do know what some guys go through with being the male in the group. Out of 40-50 employees, I am the only male in the school. If something breaks, I'm the one they call; if some critter needs wacked, I'm the one they call; and most unfortunately, if something (usually heavy) needs moved, I'm the one they call. Sometimes if feels I spend more time out of the classroom, than in the classroom. But hey; one good thing about this situation is that I have learned a lot of very valuable insight from the woman's perspective. After so long, I became just "one of the girls" to them. They would forget sometimes that I was a guy they were telling something to.
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Date: 9/12/2000 3:38:00 PM
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Author:
Craig
(cd.sups.ecc@adlink.com.au)
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Subject:Males in EC
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Hi all,
I've been really pleased with all of the discussion this forum has generated. I'd just like to say to all of the male workers who responded - there's a keg show at my house this weekend (we'll tie it in with the Olympics opening ceremony), I'd also like to invite all of the excellent, positive females who responded as well. Thankyou. The seminar on males in EC has been written and I am very pleased with it. I'll be presenting it in October at a national conference. Sadly, my friend Judy could not make it. I still think there is value in contiuing the topic, it's great to get people thinking and to read what other people's issues are. From the amount of responses it seems to be a hot topic.
As part of my research, there will be a new males in EC networking group developed in the area I live in. I would encourage other guys to do the same. Through e.groups there is also a virtual support group being developed, write to me if you want details.
Regards, Craig.
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Date: 9/12/2000 3:42:00 PM
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Author:
Craig
(cd.sups.ecc@adlink.com.au)
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Subject:Males in EC
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Hi all,
I've been really pleased with all of the discussion this forum has generated. I'd just like to say to all of the male workers who responded - there's a keg show at my house this weekend (we'll tie it in with the Olympics opening ceremony), I'd also like to invite all of the excellent, positive females who responded as well. Thankyou. The seminar on males in EC has been written and I am very pleased with it. I'll be presenting it in October at a national conference. Sadly, my friend Judy could not make it. I still think there is value in contiuing the topic, it's great to get people thinking and to read what other people's issues are. From the amount of responses it seems to be a hot topic.
As part of my research, there will be a new males in EC networking group developed in the area I live in. I would encourage other guys to do the same. Through e.groups there is also a virtual support group being developed, write to me if you want details.
Regards, Craig.
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Date: 9/22/2000 11:49:00 PM
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Author:
Kimberly
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Subject:males in childcare
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Iam the owner and director of a childcare center. We also have a Head Start Program. I have two sons (16&13) one daughter (10yrs.) My oldest son works at the center after school. The children love him!!! Every day after rest time they start asking when is Champ (yes his name) going to be here. It's not just the little boys but the little girls to. He brings something very special to the chilren. He is receiving something so important back from them. He is learning how special children are. How to be a positive roll model. How to love a child as a individual. The list goes on and on. But most importantly he is learning how important the male role model is to children. The parents realize how much there children love Champ. I've had only positive reactions. Champs dream is to be a FBI Agent. So, to me this is a win win situation. The children are learning that they can trust, enjoy, and love males just like they can women. Champ is learning how important his role as a male is to children.
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Date: 10/17/2000 7:30:00 AM
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Author:
Miss Erin
(mina_iscool@excite.com)
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Subject:what is the problem?
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men are people just like women.
before woman were even aloud
to teach is was men. just men. only men!
men have just as much right to teach as i do.
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Date: 3/20/2002 11:07:00 AM
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Author:
Steven Munn
(steven_munn@hotmail.com)
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Subject:nappy or nappie: diaper (if ur american...
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nappy or nappie: diaper (if ur american and not british, australian, from NZ or any other english speaking place lol)
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Date: 10/17/2000 3:14:00 PM
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Author:
Miss Teacher
(cmaem)
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Subject:nappie
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A nappie is a Engilsh word for diaper.
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Date: 8/23/2002 8:04:00 PM
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Author:
jay
(munch_alot103@hotmail.com)
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Subject:nappie
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Nappie or diaper is actually spelt nappy
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Date: 10/17/2000 3:16:00 PM
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Author:
Miss Teacher
(cmaem)
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Subject:nappie
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A nappie is a Engilsh word for diaper.
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Date: 3/20/2001 6:13:00 AM
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Author:
Steven
(steven_munn@yahoo.co.uk)
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Subject:In need of contacts!!!
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Heyas everyone! I'm an 18yr old blokey training for my Btec Diploma in childhood studies (nursery nursing) and, being bored almost constantly, I just fancied a chat with come people in similar situations ie men in childcare. Anyone wants to keep in contact, please email me at
steven_munn@yahoo.co.uk
thanks a lot :)
*Steven*
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Date: 3/20/2001 7:19:00 AM
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Author:
Aya M
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Subject:in olden days, it was unheard of for a w...
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in olden days, it was unheard of for a woman to teach.
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Date: 5/3/2001 1:26:00 AM
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Author:
Nikki
(nikkitowns@hotmail.com)
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Subject:Yay for male teachers!!!
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Hello, im from New Zealand and am currently studying at teachers college there. We have one male student out of a group of 60 in our year, and he is absolutly lovely. I think males do a great job at being teachers, its important for children to have good male role models, and i think its so brave of male teachers to do what they are doing with all the issues surrounding the subject. I think it is especiallly good to see male teachers that are maori/pacific islanders, they do such a wonderful job. I just think its sad that a few bad male teachers have put a bad name on all of them - there are some horrible female teachers out there too.
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Date: 2/28/2002 4:10:00 PM
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Author:
chris
(mrplantain@hotmail.com)
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Subject:I am an ECE student in Canada and have b...
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I am an ECE student in Canada and have been through three field placements so far. The trend I have noticed in each of the placements is that at first I (as a male) was treated very cautiously by parents. It was if they didn't approve of me being at their childs centre. Over the course of each placement I was able to prove to them that I was just as good if not better than any female student teacher in the placement. This was done by providing the children with many activities that they would normally not have participated in. Parents would approach me throughout the semester to let me know what a great job I was doing. I was just happy to help them get over their Biases. I am proof that not all male teachers are gay or pedofiles. I hope that people can continue to open up to male teachers in daycare because we have a lot to offer to the industry.
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Date: 3/4/2002 11:53:00 AM
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Author:
twobear
(twobear@execpc.com)
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Subject:While I agree with just about everything...
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While I agree with just about everything you have said, I am uncomfortable with your comment about "not all male teachers are gay or pedofiles." You seem to be equating the two, or at least saying that they are similar. That is not true. Most children that are sexually abused are the victims of a "straight" male family member. Many gay men work with children and are execellent teachers.
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Date: 3/10/2002 9:33:00 PM
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Author:
Shawn
(ShawnAdams@earlychildhood.com)
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Subject:I am a big bear of a man, I stand 60 ta...
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I am a big bear of a man, I stand 6'0 tall and weigh in at 300 lbs. Are the children scared of me when we meet, of course they are, but then I'm afraid of bears too. They learn soon though that I'm a big teddy bear not a scary bear. I don't know many female teachers who can be a tree for the children to climb, or who let the children hang from their arms like a jungle gym, or like to play in the mud, the slime, and I'm not afraid of bugs. The children learn that when they are hurt my big strong bear arms are their to hold and comfort them. They like the feel of my beard. I've had many children who like to rub my face while they go to sleep, or just to see how it feels, and Judy I'm assuming that if you can grow a beard you shave, so you can't give them that it's uniquely male. I'm not shy with the kisses or the squishes(hugs) either. I've had people upset with my being in the classroom, I talk with them and tell them of my credentials, and most importantly of why I love teaching children. This is an important step in the process. Don't just let it stay unsaid, you have a right to be heard but they also have the right to question your priorities, not because you are a man, but because it's likely their child will spend more of their young life with you than them. I don't take it personally, I feel that parents should get to know all of their children's caregivers like this and I'm happy for the opportunity to let them get to know me. It also helps prevent miscommunication. I had another teacher tell me once that a parent was uncomfortable with their child sitting on my lap. This hurt me deeply to think that this parent thought I would harm their child. But I steeled myself up and had a meeting with that parent. I found out that my co-teacher had been mistaken, it wasn't me. The parent felt it was inappropriate for the child to sit on anyone's lap, even theirs. This was the way she was raised and the way she was raising her children. I felt a lot better, and we respected the parent's wish, therfore strenghtening the bond between the teaching team and the parent. I've also found that many children feel safer when they are with me. I even had a child that would not take a nap until I came to class(about halfway through naptime). I asked her once why she wouldn't nap without me in the room. She said very matter of factly that she just couldn't sleep without a teddy bear to watch over her. I was very touched. In closing I would just like to say that their are men who love nurturing young children as much as women do. We are here to stay ladies, so rather than complain about us, share your secrets with us, and we'll share ours with you, our mission is the same, to raise the future generation to be loving, caring and kind, to all people, not just women. And nothing makes my day greater than when those little kiddos come up and say squish me Shawn. So I squish them, and they feel safe and loved. Isn't that what it's all about. P.S. About the handy man thing. I have never been asked to perform any of the Mr. fixit duties around the centers I have worked. But I did volunteer my services, because my grandpa told me that's what men are supposed to do. But If anyone is really hellbent to clean up the plugged up toilet mess I'll let them have it. I'll head down to the pub for a pint with the rest of the guys!!!!!
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Date: 3/20/2002 11:04:00 AM
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Author:
Steven Munn
(steven_munn@hotmail.com)
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Subject:Shawn
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Hell, you're just the sort of guy I want 2 come work at our school....i qualified a yr ago, and have been on a temporary contract running till may 31st 2002 (and have a permanent contract starting june 1st 2002 which is nice!), and have yet to come across another bloke who I would happily go out for a pint with...the one bloke who did come for an interview was a right stroppy old guy, kept on about if he didn't get the job he'd be able to sue for sexual discrimination etc etc etc....
anyways, its nice to hear about how u work, I can relate to everything you said....except the beard bit (maybe I'll have to look into growing one...!). We're a very affectionate school as a whole; I worked at a place before where u weren't allowed any contact with the kids (even if they fell over or whatever), which really annoyed me.
Being tall and big built myself, the kids like to use me as a climbing frame (and a hairdressing doll cuz I have long hair...many's the time they've plaited it and so on-I don't mind, as long as I can take it out before I leave!!).
Aaaaaaaaaanyway, I'm just drivelling on now I think so I'll bring this to a halt...nice to hear from you mate; and if you're ever in my local, mine's a pint :-D
*Steven*
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Date: 4/30/2002 6:20:00 AM
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Author:
Mr. Steven
(CHLUPL@hotmail.com)
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Subject:so glad to find ya...
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I am 20 and am in college now with major of ECE. I just got my first head teacher position with a 3 yr old class. Previously, I worked in a lab school on my college campus which had kinda optimal ratios and arrangements rather than my current job which prefers following minimum standard raios and such. I love my job anyway, and really can't imagine being happy in any other field (except maybe pediatric nursing, but I still don't think so)... I have a group on yahoo that is fairly inactive, but I would love to get it going. We currently have several nannies but now other child care workers. It is called Male Child Care Providers. I will try to post the exact address soon.. in a hurry now. I would be interested in any groups or organizations you can point to. I am in Texas of USA.
As far as harrassment... I have definitely had my share and your share and a few other peoples' as well, hehe... I have found it extremely difficult getting a job and if they are "willing" to hire, I am stuck with schoool agers. I finally got a job in a pre-k class with 3-5yrs and loved it. at that center I would help out in all levels in the pre-k class, but when I would float to the infant or toddler rooms, I was not allowed to help with diapers and such. The job I just got (after almost giving up and going into other feild) is very open. The director has worked with males before, she is a paren of a young girl who is in my class (meaning she personally is not bothered by it), and offered my any age group I wanted to work with. My speciallization in classes are infant and toddler, but my experience is pre-k, so I ended up comprimising to the three yr old class. I have only been there a few weeks, but I love my kids already.
Oh dear, I really should go...
Anyway... if you can find the group please join and I hope to hear more on this board (Even though the group's focus is males, there are some females there and you are welcome, i am happy to even have one of the three founders of the National Association of Nannies here in america.... I got something pubblished in their newsletter due to her readiang one of my posts, hehe)...
Mr Steven Grimes
Male ChildCare Providers mod
3 yr old teacher
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Date: 5/10/2002 1:55:00 AM
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Author:
kirsty
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Subject:great topic
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Hi there,
I am writing from New Zealand :)
I have just finished interviewing 3 people who we have shortlisted for my centre and one of them was a Male who is early childhood trained with a diploma and full teacher registration.
It is so great to have a guy apply for the positon and he showed such great interest and passion in his field. The 3 of us on the iterview pannel thought he was great.
We have choosen to go with the guy and I am telling him on monday that he has the job.
I am going to be the acting/relieving manager for 8 months while my boss is away ( her last day today) and I am a little worried about concerns/complaints I may get from some parents about a male in the centre.
Can anyone help me by being prepared about what concerns/comments I may get and how to handle this? I have just stepped up to the job as acting/relieving manager, before I was senior in the over two's.
I can see the majority of people will be fine but there is bound to be someone with a concern.
any help would be great.
thanks
kirsty
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Date: 5/8/2002 8:06:00 AM
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Author:
Robert Walls
(rwallsone@aol.com)
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Subject:Male Teachers in K-3
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I am a doctoral candidate at Youngstown State University in the EdD program and as part of my dissertation research I am looking into data on males in universities/colleges Early Childhood Education (ECE) Programs and current males teaching in grades K-3. I would like to send a survey/questionnaire to any current or former male and/or female K-3 teacher or student in university/college ECE program interested in assisting me in this research. Thanks for any help.
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Date: 5/9/2002 8:14:00 AM
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Author:
Gina
(grdvalejos@aol.com)
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Subject:Male Teachers
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This was most definetly one of the best threads that I have read in a long time. I have been an administrator in Child Development Centers for the past 10 years and I have employed the best and worst of both males and females. I believe that children should be exposed to a well balanced life and having both genders in their programs enhances those experiences.
Judy to say that men should be placed in positions as principals because that is where they should be is absurd. How do you expect that principal to guide you through your professional career when they have not experienced being in the classroom? I would expect this from either sex.
I currently run a small afterschool program with 1 female staff and 1 male staff and the children love them both equally. It is not because of their gender but because of the respect and the curriculum that they bring to the center.
Good Luck Men!
ECE just needs to have good providers regardless of their anatomies.
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Date: 5/13/2002 10:37:00 PM
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Author:
Craig d'arcy
(cd.sups.ecc@bigpond.com)
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Subject:Males in EC
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Hi, I'm the guy who started off this thread over two years ago. I thought I'd check the site and was amazed to find the thread still going. A question - Ifyou don't have a male staff member, how do you include the fathers in your programme? Do you think that father and father figures are included in EC services as much as mothers are? Opinions?
Judy, Judy.... are you out there?
Thanks
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Date: 7/24/2002 5:42:00 AM
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Author:
Boris Selan
(boris.selan@guest.arnes.si)
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Subject:male preschool teacher from Slovenija Europe
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Hello Craig!!!
My name is Boris Selan and I come from Slovenija in Europe. I have been
working in kindergarten this autumn for 14 year's. Also in my country I bit
a pioneer in this area too. When I read this converseation in Early
Childhod Forum Conference about Males in Early Childhood I fell realy good.
I'm impressed how many males are work in kindergarten's around the world.
I realy wonder about your reserach project! Can you tell me more about a
results of your's researching.
Have a nice day, Boris
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Date: 5/14/2002 4:14:00 AM
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Author:
Brooke Stabp
(bjssquarud@enter.net)
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Subject:Site
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I'm a 33 year old male that's been in childcare for close to 10 years now. I'm doing a workshop on Men's roles in the Childcare field and I would like you to know that I am enjoying your site and the many more like it.I never knew there were sites like this available until I started researching the topic. So, here's to all the men breaking down the walls of missconception of men in childcare.
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Date: 5/16/2002 2:56:00 AM
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Author:
Mr. Steven
(CHLUPL@hotmail.com)
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Subject:An organization
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You know, there are obviously many men in childcare, and we still have hardly a wisper going out to the world. I think there are probably many good men that are getting tired of being pushed away and are probably going into other careers. I know I have seriously thought about it. I think there are also many who are sticking it out or are fitting right in, but would love some type of professional organization that was devoted to promoting "males in childcare". I know that if I could find any organization, I would be happy to join. I was told told of a small on in San Fransisco, but have yet to hear anything else on it. if anyone else knows of any, let me know. The idea of a national or international organization may be able to grow from a small regional group. Brooke, where is the workshop you are doing? I wish you all the best.
Steven
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Date: 6/16/2002 4:00:00 PM
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Author:
Phil
(amanda@caramel.demon.co.uk)
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Subject:Not being able to change nappies/diapers.
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My name is phil, I manage a children's day nursery that cares for and educates children from 4 weeks old to 11 years old in England. I am shocked at how some of you men just seem to accept the fact that you are not allowed to change the children when they need to be changed, I work with another man in my Nursery and there is also a male student on placement with us, he would not get acredited on his course if he could not change a child, so how do you get qualified in childcare/education without this vital part of the job?
On another front I am in two days time, providing a workshops for men wanting to enter childcare, at a childcare seminar in England, I wish I had found this site before I completed my research as it would have made it damn site easier.
Phil.
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Date: 6/17/2002 10:53:00 AM
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Author:
Lacey
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Subject:male diapering
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My husband works in EC (I do too), and changes diapers regularly. One parent of a little girl has brought up the request the he not change diaper (with no substantiation other than that he is male). Other than that, the parents trust the directors that hired him.
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Date: 6/17/2002 11:24:00 AM
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Author:
Steven
(steven_munn@hotmail.com / steven_munn@yahoo.co.uk)
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Subject:re: changing children
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I totally agree with Phil on this one....working full time with 3-5 yr olds in a state nursery school, I change anywhere between 1 and 10 children every day; how good would it look if I told the female staff (ie everyone except me hehe) that they had to do it? I'd get strung up!
Also its nice to see some training lads posting, keep at it guys :-)
Anywhoo, anyone who wants to get hold of me can contact me at the above addy's. Check out our schools website (done by me *cheesy grin*) if you get bored, but it needs updating for this year!! www.start.at/grasmere
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Date: 6/17/2002 1:54:00 AM
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Author:
Paul
(mieyce@yahoo.co.uk)
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Subject:Contacts
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I am an 18 year old Male who is studying Early Years Care and Education in England. I love working with children and it's great to find this site and see so many males working in Childcare.
I would be interested to hear from other Males who are working in Childcare.
I can be contacted at: mieyce@yahoo.co.uk
I am looking forward to hearing from some of you soon.
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Date: 7/13/2002 8:13:00 AM
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Author:
Barry Bussewitz
(barry.bussewitz@solano.cc.ca.us)
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Subject:changing diapers as a labor right
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I have not explored the legal technicalities of the men-changing diaper issues, but it seems to me that if we are not readily allowed and expected to change diapers, then we are not able to do the job of providing care for young children. This would make us less employable and strikes me as job discrimination. If I were given this prohibition I would act against it. I would expect both social and legal systems to be on my side, let alone the morality and ethics of it. Children need the loving care of both women and men in their lives, and I consider that I have the right to provide that -- especially if it is my professional responsiblity!
Greetings! I just found this site through the naeycmen listserv , largely used by members of the "men in education network" of the National Association for the Education of Young Children (NAEYC), an organization founded in the U.S. The listserv is for women and men who encourage and advocate for men in Early Childhood Education.
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Date: 7/7/2005 7:50:00 PM
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Author:
Heather
(tothemaxx04@yahoo.com)
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Subject:I wanted to reply to your posting on men...
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I wanted to reply to your posting on men working in childcare! I work in a 5 star NAEYC accredited daycare center in North Carolina (USA). Out of 28 people that work at our center 1 is male! He has been at the center for over 7 years, he is 50+ years old, and works at the center from 1pm-6pm everyday. He is "allowed" to change diapers in the center but he prefers not to... this is his choice because in this world that we are living in he feels that by placing himself in that position he is leaving the door open for some over eager parent to say that he touched their child inappropriately. I think that it is sorry for our society to place such a stereo type on men! This guy is the sweetest most caring man I have ever met! He genuinely loves all of these children and would never hurt any of them!
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Date: 7/31/2002 9:24:00 AM
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Author:
Steven
(CHLUPL@hotmail.com)
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Subject:Update from my neck of the woods
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Well, it has been a long time since I have visited this discusion, and much has changed. I am no longer the teacher with that wonderful director who was so excepting of a male teacher. I was only there for about 6 weeks, but I take it as that was pretty permanent as there had been 8 other teachers in a matter of 5 months. It also seems that a previous teacher had been fired for calling CPS and for going behind the directors back about a child that was being abused (she tried working with director, but she wasn't cooperation). I, another teacher, and a parent dealt some with CPS but got nowhere, and now I am just thinking and remembering all my children back there, hoping they are well. I wish I could think of more to do to help them, but I am at a blank. I am now searching for another position in my hometown of Lubbock, Texas. It isn't going well, but I am trying to keep my hopes up.
As far as the most recent discussion, about diaper changes.. One of the jobs I was applying for, let me tell you about the interview. I had put on my resume that I had helped some with infants and toddlers in addition to my main placement with the pre-k. The lady read, lowered the paper, and asked, "What exactly did you do in the infant room?" I started listing, "helpe with feeding, putting them to nap, helping them learn to walk, sit up," ect..., and she just kept this dumb-founded face the whole time. I finally said, "I didn't change any diapers"... she pulls her hand to her chest in almost a shocked look, then says, "Well, I was wondering about that!"... I was so upset.
You see, I am sure that the place that you live "local culture" has a lot to do with what will be "expected of you". I can't imagine wanting to hire someone who cannot do all the duties of a care-giver. I really don't like working at a place that treats me as a "special case" that only has select responsibilities. But, I find it very rewarding to work with children, and if I must give up a little pride to do so, then so be it. If I go in to get a job, I am typically overly-questioned, but if I were to go in to get a job and then tell them that I require the duty of changing diapers and ect..., then they will have that much more to add to their little "conspiracy theory" that all males in ECE are sick and want to take advantage of the children. I feel like I cannot ever be an optimal teacher/caregiver as long as I am under such petty restrictions, but on the other hand, if I become too proactive, I fear I may never be a teacher/caregiver at all. That thought is scary. That thought is not something I want to think about. I figure, once I have years of experience, a sparkling education, and am considered a professional, than I just might have a voice strong enough to be heard. But as of now, it is too easy for me to be silenced, so I choose not to do it alone.
Steven
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Date: 8/1/2002 1:40:00 AM
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Author:
Paul
(mieyce@yahoo.co.uk)
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Subject:Website for Males in Childcare
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Please feel free to check out my website for Males working in childcare.
The site is: http://www.geocities.com/mieyce
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Date: 8/14/2002 11:12:00 AM
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Author:
Connie
(cmaem@hotmail.com)
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Subject:dis agree
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If a female teachere in your day care was acting this way with the children. Not expressing love for the children, letting them sit on her etc. people would ask why she is in this field and she would be told to make a better connetion with the children or find another job. Why should a male have any other rule?
As for parents who are wary of having a male teacher in the centre I say tough luck. Get over it or find another child care situation. You hire the best people for the job reguardless of sex.
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Date: 8/14/2002 11:27:00 AM
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Author:
Gina
(grdvalejos@aol.com)
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Subject:Safety Rules for male teachers
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I would definetly also have to disagree with the rules that you are advising others to partake in. People can be harmful to children regardless of their sex. When you are in the field of Early Childhood Education, being attentive and loving come with the job.
Denying a child the assistance of buttoning up thier clothes is a lost opportunity of assisting them to learn how to do it by themselves. What do single fathers do? They treat their children with love and respect and should others wonder what they are doing with their child, it becomes that other person's problem.
When parents enroll children in the facility of thier choice they should decide whether they are comfortable with a male teacher. I have been in the field for nearly 20 years and I have seen good and bad male and female teachers. When I have an issue I take it to the source and make adjustments accordingly.
Don't allow a stereotype to continue! Be yourself and enjoy the children.
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Date: 8/14/2002 11:47:00 AM
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Author:
Barry Bussewitz
(barry.bussewitz@solano.cc.ca.us)
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Subject:young children need hugs, laps, love and diaper changes!
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Jesse:
When I read your five rules I began to think you must be making a facetious statement. Assuming you were being straightorwardly sincere, I do endorse your right to work out your relationship with your work in all appropriate ways that protect your own wellbeing and aslo serve your young client fully. I clearly understand there are many compelling reasons to be thoughtful in this regard.
However, I would also strenuously object to the generalization of those admonitions to others. If they were applied to me as a caregiver I would simply not be able to do my job because I would need a nanny to protect me or the children at all times -- and to give young children the care that they need and deserve and that makes being an early childhood professional a significant, important, and distinct professional calling.
Young children need physical care: they need hugs, laps, love and, often, diaper changes. If I am not allowed to provide those and a lot more, I cannot do my job. How could I even be hired to do the job with those limitations? I am concerned about what your clients want for their children if they are comforted by your willingness to do none of that.
My approach as an educator is to question, counter and educate myself and others regarding phobias and biases that are detrimental to children, as well as to face the threatening realities of both irrational fears and valid concerns. In my college classes I work to examine and counter anti-male bias, as well as other forms of "isms" (racism, sexism, classism, ageism, etc.), because they limit us all.
At the National Association for the Education of Young Children national conference in New York City this November, I am scheduled to present a workshop entitled, "Can Homophobia Be Cured? A dialogue/exploration into the social and spiritual aspects of seeing anti-homosexual hostility as a social problem that concerns Early Childhood Educators personally and professionally in our work with children and families. All welcome."
This workshop, and the conference in general, are representative of the many opportunities I find essential both personally and professionally in terms of finding allies and forming networks for the difficult challenge of creating a socio-cultural context in which young children can be fairly served. I repeat that I respect your need to make your personal choices that work for you. I encourage you both to consider the wider context of their implications and to join with others to change oppressive fears, biases and ignorance.
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Date: 8/14/2002 10:40:00 PM
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Author:
Steven
(steven_munn@hotmail.com)
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Subject:Hmmm.....nappy debate
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Hummm....tho I appreciate the concern, I think Jesse is going slightly overboard with the safety thing....I change an average of 6 or 7 children a day (and these being 3-5yr olds; we're not talking nappies/diapers anymore remember), and I'm expected to do this. Its simply part of my job ~ might not be a very pleasant part of it, but its part of it. If I were to refuse, then I wouldn't be employed.
Take the bad stuff with the good, and you'll find the good far outweighs the concept of having to change a child once in a while.
Steven
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Date: 8/24/2002 8:24:00 PM
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Author:
scott
(wildturkey@git.com)
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Subject:howdy craig im from perth and work in ...
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howdy craig
im from perth and work in childcare i have been doing it for about 4 years. i have had some negative and positive responses to me working in childcare. some of the relief staff we have had in the centre have been very against me working in the centre, but they were never called back again. the staff i worked with were a little unsure when i first started working there but now everyone is cool about it. we have had a few parents that have been very against me but my boss has backed me up and told them to take there children and leave the centre and dont come back. some of the parents are glad there is a male in the centre as some children dont have a dad , so i become their rolemodel, or just a bmale for them to be with. some of the children have never been able to kick a footy but their parents are grateful that i was there to teach them how to kick it. some of the staffget annoyed because they need to speak to a parent but the parent walks straight past them and comes to speak to me. the staff just tell me what they need to tell them and i tell them. i still have some parents thta wont speak to me very much. but the way i see is they are simple minded people who see the world one way, and dont wont it changed, but they are usually the people who complain about equal rights. in a country (i think its chilli) a third of childcare workers have to be male. i still get comments from people when i go out and meet them about my job, but then i ask them what they do and a majority of the time they say maccas or there a checkout chik ,so my response is get a real job then critise me. i think more males should be in childcare and that it should advertised that its a good thing and that more are needed, to influence the children that need a male role model.
its good to see somebody is doing something about it, go for it mate.
scott
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Date: 8/25/2002 11:52:00 PM
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Author:
Cathy
(chindle@telus.net)
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Subject:comments and a couple of questions
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Wow! I stumbled on this site while originally looking for poems/inspirational stories to share with parents for a parent-night the week before school starts. (That's what you get when you do a search for "Early Childhood". Any of you guys into the "inspirational short stories" thing? Let me know if you have a good one.)
Anyway...I should have gone to bed hours ago, but once I got here I couldn't stop reading. Craig, did you expand your workshop/etc. into a book on the subject? If you do, sign me up for a copy!
I have a few comments. First, I've never had the chance to work full-time with a male in a child-care setting, but I would love to! We had a male Out-of-School care staff person at the centre where I did some daycare work. He was GREAT with the kids, and I heard only positive things from everyone involved with him. Unfortunately he was just getting experience for entrance into an Elem. teacher-training program. Yes, wages are an issue. A friend of mine worked in child care until she retired, but her husband was an architect. My husband's a courier. Add that to my preschool teacher's salary and try to get a mortgage on a starter home in our area, and I think bank managers have to keep from laughing until we leave. What do men do, especially if they want to have a family of their own?
Re. ideas for involving Fathers--our preschool did not have "duty days", but when one of the two teachers was ill we were allowed to have a parent substitute (to assist the qualified teacher). There was a Father I worked with who out-classed anyone who came to help. He was there to interact with all of the children and I was able to run the program for the day almost as if my co-worker was present. Often (--not always--I don't want to start anything here--) when Mothers came in, they paid the most attention to their child and I had to do behaviour-management for the others in the group and could not do my activities as planned. The Mothers had an attitude that suggested I should be grateful they came to help (and I was), but they were not to be told what to do or how to do it. They were the Mothers (I have no children). They weren't interested in trying to hear from me about what was appropriate and what was not in their interactions with the children. We also had Dads at the concerts/parent evenings/parent-teacher conferences.
The best time involving Fathers was what became an annual compliment to our Mother's Day Tea in May. We had a Father/child picnic a couple of weeks before the end of school each year (school's over before Father's Day). We had families each provide a sandwich tray, veggie tray, fruit tray, desert tray, pop or chips. Paper plates, plastic forks and juice boxes were the order of the day. And each Father came with a blanket (for the last hour of the a.m. class, and the first hour of the p.m. class). They had lunch with their child(ren) on their blankets on the lawn, and then we played some games, etc. We had the professional Dads -- Doctors and Businessmen, etc. taking the lunch-hour to be with their child at school (and playing hula-hoops and jump-rope and doing obstacle courses with their little ones). We took pictures and gave everyone a keepsake photo of them with their children. (The second year we had no games for the Dads--the Doctor was grateful, but others were disappointed!) With enough notice (from September), almost every Dad was able to make it. Children whose Father couldn't come invited an Uncle or Grandfather to take his place, so every child had a special guest to spend the day with.
Back to the political stuff for a minute. At one school I worked for, the one-time President of the Board (non-profit) confided that they had a male applicant for a teaching job, but that they did not even consider him. His attitude was that men --if they teach-- should teach High School, or Junior High. Upper Elementary, maybe. "But a man who wants to work with young children, there must be something wrong with him." I was disgusted by that attitude! This man was a Father to two preschoolers. Just one of those business people who believe men should want to be in higher-paying, more prestigious jobs (unless there was something wrong with them and they couldn't get hired). (This man also did not have much respect for the young women teachers, either, other than to flirt with the ones he liked and to carefully scrutinize the work of the others.) What can you do in response when someone who can get you fired has an attitude like this? (I liked the job otherwise.) How do we go beyond complaining and change the attitude of others in society like him? (Because it is a wider, societal/cultural issue.)
P.S. to Jamie from CA -- Thanks for the tips on playing with the boys! One of my favourite toys as a young girl was trucks and matchbox cars. I'll have to try a "truck voice", but I don't think the children will "buy it" from me :).
One last question...Any tips from the men on how to really get the boys (3-5) into art? I taught Art for Early Childhood Education students one semester before moving to a new Province. I had never had a problem with boys not wanting to do art, but some of the students did and I'm not sure my suggestions helped. The text mentioned that all children need to do art, but didn't say how to get reluctant boys to do it! When I teach again, I'd like to have some hints to pass on. Thanks, guys!
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Date: 9/14/2002 7:48:00 AM
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Author:
Kendra
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Subject:Posting on this thread for hte first tim...
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Posting on this thread for hte first time in years..... :P
My partner is school-aged this year is a guy. He is working out wonderfully. He is not from a child care background though both of his sisters have their early childhood training and he's worked with scouts and cadets for years (he's 21) We are working on the plans together. My strengths are creative and manipulative and his are active games (our outdoor program has never been so active)
We have so many children in our program this year that we have to split the group into two for about 45 minutes a day (the inside play time when there are too many kids for one room)
These first 2 weeks we've stayed together so he could sorta get the hang of things befor going head first into the whole deal but next week he'll be on his own and I have the highest confidence in him. He has the younger group (grades 1 and 2) right now, we didn't want to overwelm him with the biggies right out. We are planning on swithing off groups every month. (So the older guys get the "cool man" and I get to easier for me younger group)
Beyond the school-aged aspects he has part of his shift durring the day in our preschool conponent. He works in the sleeproom rubbing backs and supervising the non-sleepers. He can get the hardest kid to sleep. He also helps out with wake up washroom routine.
He's already been innitiated into the child care society. 4 days into his child care career he got puked on by a 4 year old. He says its his badge of honor.
None of our parents have raise any concerns about him which says a lot about both his presentation of himself and their willingness to work towards quality care with us. (those who have commented have said how wonderful it is to have a man in the center)
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Date: 7/14/2005 6:43:00 PM
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Author:
Terri
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Subject:The young men I have seen in daycare env...
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The young men I have seen in daycare environments were always placed in the rooms with the older children. I have never seen them placed in the rooms for infants. I do believe society reserves that place for females and that it is a fairly universal choice.
The males placed in the pre-K or school age groups in my experience were usually casual toward curriculum. Often they would become engrossed in typical child play with the boys, or even sit there in front of the video games with them while others in the group were ignored.
On the playground, male daycare teachers often play basketball as if they are with their peers. Although the small group of boys in the class who enjoy basketball are thrilled to have an older "playmate", I have found that the interaction simply satisfies the male teachers own desire to "play".
Little by litte they regress into more childlike behavior, playing, rough housing, eating, and interacting on a level that is less like a teacher and more like a kid.
I also wonder why they would choose to work with infants, toddlers, and preschoolers.
What is their goal? What is their motivation?
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Date: 7/8/2005 8:02:00 AM
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Author:
Rudy
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Subject:men in childcare
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I totally agree. Just because a man is working with children that doesn't make him a child molester. Unfortunately like you stated socoety has stereotyped that role as being for women. I wish more men could get into the field. There are a lot of children that need that male role model in their lives that don't have it. I have worked with some men in the field and have never met one that was bad yet. actually there have been more women than men in trouble.
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Date: 7/14/2005 9:47:00 PM
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Author:
Rudy
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Subject:males preschool teachers
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I am sorry that you have that opinion of males. Couldn't it be that they just like kids? It is too bad that soceity has to make teaching (especially Preschool) a female dominated area. No it isn't a glamorous, or high paying career but then whay do women get into this field. I have seen a lot of women that don't particularly like children that are working with them. I would much rather see a man work with them that really enjoys it than a woman that doesn't. There are also some boys that need that male role model in their lives. What is wrong with a teacher playing with the kids( male or Female) I think that is part of yor job in interacting with them. Good job to the male of which you are speaking
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Date: 7/18/2005 11:47:00 AM
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Author:
Jen
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Subject:teachers
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My center has men in both the toddler and preschool programs and until recently, also in the infant program. They are teachers and have the same responsibilites as all teachers. They create plans, activities, developmental profiles, conduct parent meetings, etc. Everyone's individual goals and motivations may vary, but ultimately every teacher wants to make a difference in the lives of young children and their families.
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Date: 7/18/2005 3:25:00 PM
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Author:
Rudy
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Subject:teachers
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That is really great that there are males in your center. Men can also touch the lives of children and should be given the opportunity.
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Date: 9/21/2005 1:55:00 PM
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Author:
Panditha
(IwantToyota2000GT@hotmail.com)
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Subject:schools that allow males to change diapers?
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does any one here know of any preschools/nurseries etc. that actually do allow men to change diapers,
potty train and basically do everytying females are are allowed to do, in other words they are treated equally and there is little or no tensile situations or worries about being fired for just doing your job? I wish more schools especially NAYEC schools would post this kind of stuff :(
PLEASE respond to me email or here.
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Date: 9/27/2005 6:28:00 AM
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Author:
sonnie
(beezee272000@yahoo.com)
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Subject:males diapering in EC centers
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We have employed males in the past. Depending on which room they were employed in they participated just like the females. We have only had one parent express concern and we offered to let them come and visit at any time. After they became acquainted with the young man their concerns left.
All of the young men we have employed have been wonderful influences with the young children and there is not one of them I would have traded for a lady. They brought postive male role modeling for children who are being raised without Dad's in their lives and are the favorites of the children. The young gentleman working for me now has been with us for five years. He is very versitle and dependable. I can place him in any age environment and he does well. The parents love him. Unfortunately he won't be with us much longer as he is working towards a degree in law.
It is unfortunate that childcare wages are not high enough for males (and females) to be able to support a family. I would like to see more males in the profession; they bring a welcome dimension into the profession.
Our town also has a male director who also spends time in the classroom...he also changes diapers.
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Date: 2/19/2007 10:27:00 PM
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Author:
greg martina
(atl4greg@yahoo.com)
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Subject:fired being a male
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Yes i got hired because i had the paper work to back up my education and i also had letters from co-workers,director,and parents that states my hands on training and my work skills. I was placed in the 2 year old class and was told i could not change the children nor was i allow to assist in the restrooms, after about 3 days thy asked me to leave because it was no need to have me there and they still needed to find someone to change the children. Along with that I was already told some of the parents did not want me there cause i was a guy. Also Monica the owner was making a fuss the second day saying the children were going home wet, but that day they had another lady in the class with me as each child parent came in she would check the child and tie the lace and send the child off, the classrooms have camaras and Monica insisted that i was not doinig my job. But how was i to be held responsible for my job and she never allowed me to do my job. But i left broken heart and depressed, But 3 days later i filled an application and turn it in the next day and I am working at a better center.
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Date: 2/27/2007 11:08:00 AM
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Author:
Rudy
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Subject:males in centers
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That is too bad that you had a bad experience. Unfortunately OUR soecity says things that people believe instead of making their own decisions. Males in the child care field is wonderful. There are some children that have no male role model in their homes and this is a great opportunity to have this. I would think that their are ways to protect yourself and still be able to change the children. You could change one with another teacher at the same time so you were never alone with the child. I am glad you are in a better place. Good Luck
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Date: 9/24/2005 5:09:00 AM
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Author:
Nicole Knock
(nickdave1@hotmail.com)
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Subject:Males in EC
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Boy, oh man, do i wish that I had seen this in the year 2000. As an Expat Australian working in Viet Nam currently, I am caught between two cultures here. Men in EC in Viet Nam, I don't think so. Not yet anyway! In Oz, some of the best EC workers are men and I can say that with 15years experience in EC in Australia and now Viet Nam that we need more men. We need them for all sorts of reasons and its the same as we need quality EC women workers. For the stats, 80% of people who abuse children in EC are women. As we have more women in EC that figure is somwhat obvious, but for goodness sake, we dont need /want or should tolerate those women. We need quality people whether they are women or men. I honestly cant believe that we are still questionning why men are in EC as that was being questioned 15years ago. There were three dedicated guys in my college who dropped out of the EC course because of the pure ignorance of the Business, Communications students and Primary Teachers "bagging the hell out" of the EC guys. WHY oh why??
Man oh man, we need more of you and quality ones at that.
Cheers and have a good day all!!
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Date: 11/29/2005 10:12:00 PM
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Author:
Susie
(suzy_14@hotmail.com)
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Subject:Im an ECE student and im doing a researc...
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Im an ECE student and im doing a research assignment on issues that male ECE's face and how it effects the growth/health of children.. if anyone can help me out.. please email me
@ suzzo_vellas@hotmail.com
thanks!!!
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Date: 12/29/2005 2:36:00 AM
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Author:
Craig d'Arcy
(MalesInEarlyChildhood@hotmail.com)
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Subject:Nearly 5 years later
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Hi everyone
Whilst doing some research on the net, I came across my old topic that I started in 2000. Is this is a record?
Time has moved on a little bit as far as males in early childhood go. I established a networking group in 2002 (tell me if you want to go on the mailing list to get meeting reports) and am in the middle of developing the first males in early childhood summit / conference in Australia - for May 2006 (let me know if you want some more details).
I am a Director of a long day care centre presently - still the only male on the staff team. Oh well, that hasn't changed!
I'm really keen to hear from other guys out there (and empathetic sisters too)- we can achieve so much if we stick together. A possible meeting point is;
www.malesinearlychildhood.bravehost.com
I will check in and talk to you later.
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Date: 1/16/2006 11:03:00 PM
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Author:
nellie
(nelyjati66@yahoo.com.sg)
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Subject:Male preschool teachers
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Hi, I'm from Singapore and currently doing my action research papers. my group have decided to find out Why the negative attitude towards Male Preschool teachers.we have not much literature on the subject of male preschool teacher/ male teachers here. can anyone recommend any books, magazines that we may use to support our research paper .Please share some of your experiences and opinion on the matter. You may reach me at nelyjati66@yahoo.com.sg or teacher_nellie@yahoo.co.uk. Kezillion thank you.. :)
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Date: 11/18/2006 11:01:00 AM
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Author:
Jessica
(chesney4@tcnj.edu)
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Subject:Im doing a research paper on males in Early Childhood Education
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Hi! My professor told me to take a look at this forum and see if it could help with a current research paper that I am doing on the crisis in boys' education. I am looking at two topics: whether or not boys are affected by the gender of their teacher, mainly if female teachers are having a negative impact on boys' development, and then I am also looking at why there are so few men in the early childhood arena. If you have any information or would like to share any of your stories with me, I would greatly appreciate that! Thank you!
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Date: 11/20/2006 12:14:00 PM
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Author:
Abe Reichlin
(reichlin@simmons.edu)
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Subject:Males working with children
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Hey there! I hope all are well. I found this site just a minute ago and love the discussion about males working with children. I have been working with kids for many years. From these experiences - both good and bad - I have decided to write a book. More specifically, I am attempting to write against the stigma of being a male
working with kids in 21st century America.
I post here to get feedback. It would be great to hear from those who either have stories about working with children (even if you're female) or have information about places that I can get more information about males working with children, be that scholarly articles or other useful information. Email me back at reichlin@simmons.edu
Thanks!
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Date: 1/22/2007 10:49:00 AM
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Author:
Ben
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Subject:Very Inspirational
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I am a 25-year-old male in Canada. ECE is the profession I've always known would suit me best but I've stalled due to the unfair weirdness factor. It's sad to admit, but I was worried about what family and friends would think of me, and also how I'd be accepted as a male in the field. This thread has helped me put things into perspective and I now believe stronger than ever that the only opinions of me as a person that I'll ever truly respect are the opinions of the children I'll be working with.
I honestly expected there'd be more like "Judy" but after reading so many intelligent comments I began wondering if she was just a prank. Then there's "Terri" who took it to another level! As long as we understand that even one such fascist is allowed influence over impressionable children, we must understand that there is a desperate need for men and women who are both sensitive and sensible to take jobs away from these people who’s disturbed perspectives render them highly inappropriate caregivers. My main motivation to teach is to prevent as many children as possible from becoming dysfunctional adults like Judy and Terri.
About the diaper debate…
There has to be a least-favourite aspect of every job and I’m thinking that, in ECE, diapers must top the list (unless you have to work with someone like Terri.) I’d gladly trade some handyman work for diaper duty any day. However, to be told by a boss or—worse—by a parent that I’m not allowed to change them because I’m male would be highly insulting. But any parent who says that is obviously just as ignorant as Judy (a.k.a. The Antichrist) and cannot be expected to be rational. To make these people understand why it isn’t a problem would be as difficult as convincing the child that it is. So the easiest way I see to deal with it would be to just thank them for lightening the workload and explain that I’ll be as content to live my life as a person who hasn’t had to deal with their smelly kid, as they are to live their life as a bigot.
The children probably won’t know that their parents are discriminating against you and will remember you fondly in any case. Assuming the parents will always be stupid, you can imagine how they’ll be remembered.
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Date: 5/10/2007 3:43:00 AM
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Author:
Craig d'Arcy
(www.malesinearlychildhood.bravehost.com)
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Subject:A quick update
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Hi everyone
Well everything is going OK. Slowly, the awareness is building of the importance of having men in early childhood. I was fortunate enough to attend the New Zealand Early Childhood Council Men in Early Education national Summit. Check out
www.childforum.com
The World Forum on Care and Education has a World Forum project on men in early childhood - it's happening next week in Kuala Lumpur. You can access information through the World Forum site
www.worldforumfoundation.org
Regional Networking groups for men in EC are starting to be established in Australia - a few areas have now begun their own meetings and networking support mechanism.
I'm still the only bloke in my team, but I work with a great bunch of female EC professionals, they are an essential support. It's nice to see the thread still has some legs, obviously it's an important topic!
Craig
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Date: 5/11/2007 7:33:00 PM
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Author:
Bobbi
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Subject:we need men in ECE! get the women out!!!
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OK, that is a bit harsh, but I have worked too many day care centers here in the United States that the women accept a lower pay and less benefits 'to help keep child care costs low so moms can afford to go to work'. and the moms are NOT working to put a roof over their head, or food on the table. Funny thing is, the teachers are working cause the have a financial need to work! In these centers, the moms worked for the extras in life. Like two new family cars that are high-end to mid-priced. and the new house in the allotments that is 2000+ sq feet. plus the cleaning lady, gotta pay her. Hey, you don't see doctors charging less 'to help sick people'. No, you work, you are paid your worth. Luckily, government preschools pay more than day care centers, but still less than a livable wage for a man raising a family.
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Date: 10/6/2007 12:33:00 PM
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Author:
kayadeCex
(escarmavora@mail.ru)
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Subject:surname of homer simpson
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